Re: [Shaku] SHAKUHACHI FESTIVAL

From: stan (b@didgethings.co.uk)
Date: Thu Mar 10 2005 - 20:56:58 PST


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I'm not talking about age.

If someone knows something, they learned it in their past. If someone =
learns something, they know it for their future. In between is "now" =
"the moment" and both sides of it are as important as each other.

It's not a question of lineage or ageism.

A teacher who demands first class for himself should also demand first =
class for his student. And vice versa.

Maybe this is a little difficult for some of you to accept and =
understand. But this is the way i see things.

If some of the people on this mailing list wish to put people on =
pedastals, call them national treasures and fall at their feet, then =
please go ahead. I will not.

Good night to all.
  ----- Original Message -----=20
  From: Alan Sondheim=20
  To: Shakuhachi@communication.ucsd.edu=20
  Sent: Friday, March 11, 2005 12:17 AM
  Subject: Re: [Shaku] SHAKUHACHI FESTIVAL

  Apologies, but this is a bit nonsense. Students are just as much the =
past=20
  and teachers are just as much the future. Anything else is ageism. We =
all=20
  have our own lives and burdens to bear without imposing lineage, Dogen =
or=20
  no - Alan

  On Thu, 10 Mar 2005, stan wrote:

> Students work extremely hard too.
>
> Why is it always about the teacher?
>
> Teachers are the past, students are the future. Neither is more=20
> important than the other to create "now".
>
> ----- Original Message -----
> From: edBeaty
> To: Shakuhachi@communication.ucsd.edu
> Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 9:55 PM
> Subject: Re: [Shaku] SHAKUHACHI FESTIVAL
>
>
> >More thoughts............
> >
> >Re; first calss travel, you want your guests to be in good energy, =
not
> >jet-lagged, tired, disoriented. They have more extensive demands =
to cater to
> >than the 'students'.
>
> And the teachers work remarkably hard at their teaching tasks. =
Please
> note: This is NOT a Zen retreat, but an intensive residential
> workshop. If you want a Zen retreat, it ain't there (not even a
> pretense of it...)
>
> >
> >You get what you pay for.
> >
> >If you don't pay for it there is a real chance you won't value it.
> >
> >These occassions are 'Special', not 'Everyday'.
> >
> >I have a gallery and once thought gallery owners did not earn the =
commission
> >they take on a sale, well I know this is not the case. A gallery =
owner has
> >many overheads, rent or purchasee of the space, electricity, =
rates, wages,
> >advertising, entertainment and years of promoting an artist and =
developing a
> >clientele.
> >a
> >Celebrate diversity, think how it might be otherwise.
>
> Here, here...
>
> eB
> _____________________________________________
>
> List subscription information is at:
> http://communication.ucsd.edu/shaku/listsub.html
>
>
>
>
> --
> No virus found in this incoming message.
> Checked by AVG Anti-Virus.
> Version: 7.0.308 / Virus Database: 266.6.4 - Release Date: =
07/03/2005
>
>

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<BODY bgColor=3D#e0e0e0>
<DIV><EM><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D4>I'm not talking about=20
age.</FONT></EM></DIV>
<DIV><EM><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D4></FONT></EM>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV><EM><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D4>If someone knows =
something,=20
they&nbsp;learned it in their&nbsp;past.&nbsp; If someone learns =
something, they=20
know it for their future.&nbsp; In between is&nbsp;"now"&nbsp;"the =
moment" and=20
both sides of it are as important as&nbsp;each other.</FONT></EM></DIV>
<DIV><EM><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D4>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<DIV><EM><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D4>It's not a question of =
lineage or=20
ageism.</FONT></EM></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV></FONT></EM></DIV>
<DIV><EM><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D4>A teacher who demands =
first class for=20
himself should also demand first class for his student.&nbsp; And vice=20
versa.</FONT></EM><EM><FONT face=3D"Comic Sans MS" size=3D4></DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Maybe this is a little difficult for some of you to accept and=20
understand.&nbsp; But this is the way i see things.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>If&nbsp;some of the people on this&nbsp;mailing list&nbsp;wish to =
put=20
people on pedastals, call them national treasures and&nbsp;fall&nbsp;at =
their=20
feet, then please go ahead.&nbsp; I will not.</DIV>
<DIV>&nbsp;</DIV>
<DIV>Good night to all.</DIV></FONT></EM>
<BLOCKQUOTE=20
style=3D"PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; =
BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
  <DIV=20
  style=3D"BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: =
black"><B>From:</B>=20
  <A title=3Dsondheim@panix.com href=3D"mailto:sondheim@panix.com">Alan =
Sondheim</A>=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A=20
  title=3DShakuhachi@communication.ucsd.edu=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:Shakuhachi@communication.ucsd.edu">Shakuhachi@communicatio=
n.ucsd.edu</A>=20
  </DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Friday, March 11, 2005 =
12:17=20
  AM</DIV>
  <DIV style=3D"FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> Re: [Shaku] SHAKUHACHI =

  FESTIVAL</DIV>
  <DIV><BR></DIV><BR><BR>Apologies, but this is a bit nonsense. Students =
are=20
  just as much the past <BR>and teachers are just as much the future. =
Anything=20
  else is ageism. We all <BR>have our own lives and burdens to bear =
without=20
  imposing lineage, Dogen or <BR>no - Alan<BR><BR><BR>On Thu, 10 Mar =
2005, stan=20
  wrote:<BR><BR>&gt; Students work extremely hard too.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; =
Why is it=20
  always about the teacher?<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt; Teachers are the past, =
students are=20
  the future.&nbsp; Neither is more <BR>&gt; important than the other to =
create=20
  "now".<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; ----- Original Message =
-----<BR>&gt;&nbsp; From:=20
  edBeaty<BR>&gt;&nbsp; To: <A=20
  =
href=3D"mailto:Shakuhachi@communication.ucsd.edu">Shakuhachi@communicatio=
n.ucsd.edu</A><BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  Sent: Thursday, March 10, 2005 9:55 PM<BR>&gt;&nbsp; Subject: Re: =
[Shaku]=20
  SHAKUHACHI FESTIVAL<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;More=20
  thoughts............<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;Re; first =
calss=20
  travel, you want your guests to be in good energy, not<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  &gt;jet-lagged, tired, disoriented. They have more extensive demands =
to cater=20
  to<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;than the 'students'.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; And =
the=20
  teachers work remarkably hard at their teaching tasks. =
Please<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  note: This is NOT a Zen retreat, but an intensive =
residential<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  workshop. If you want a Zen retreat, it ain't there (not even =
a<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  pretense of it...)<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;You =
get what=20
  you pay for.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;If you don't pay for =
it=20
  there is a real chance you won't value it.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; =
&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  &gt;These occassions are 'Special', not 'Everyday'.<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  &gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;I have a gallery and once thought gallery =
owners did=20
  not earn the commission<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;they take on a sale, well I =
know=20
  this is not the case. A gallery owner has<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;many =
overheads,=20
  rent or purchasee of the space, electricity, rates, =
wages,<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  &gt;advertising, entertainment and years of promoting an artist and =
developing=20
  a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;clientele.<BR>&gt;&nbsp; &gt;a<BR>&gt;&nbsp; =
&gt;Celebrate=20
  diversity, think how it might be otherwise.<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; =
Here,=20
  here...<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; eB<BR>&gt;&nbsp;=20
  _____________________________________________<BR>&gt;<BR>&gt;&nbsp; =
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