That's interesting. I know of this phenomenon from Asian singing bowls--You
can hold a ringing bowl up to your mouth an create such wah-wah effects by
finding the right resonance in the mouth cavity. And if you were to do this
on the flute it would affect the air stream to some extent. However this is
somewhat different from the mouth forming a coupled resonator that loads the
reed. Apparently recent research has even thrown into doubt that idea that
there is a significant effect on the sound from this coupling. I play both
reeded woodwinds and flutes and used to believe that throat shape had a
large effect on sound. After careful observation I no longer believe that is
true. I think that 99% of sound changes are due to differences in the way I
blow and shape my mouth based on how I am feeling about playing. In other
words it is a holistic response of my body to my attitude which affects the
way I play by adjusting the way I hold and blow the instrument .
It is somewhat akin to the myth of "touch" on the piano. It has been well
documented that the mechanics of piano keys allow only for variations in
hammer velocity and string contact time--unlike plucked or bowed strings
which have many more attack variables. Yet we often think of a pianist's
"touch". Good players are able to get an amazing range of musical expression
with those two variables. Of course they don't think of it that way, but
their "expressiveness" translates into very fine control of two physical
parameters.
My point was that many players mistakenly assume that certain things like
posture, throat position, tongue position, etc. have a direct effect on the
sound produced, whereas for the most part these only affect the sound in a
secondary manner by affecting the primary sources of sound production--lip
position, breath volume and velocity, instrument position relative to the
lips, etc. How a player feels about the sound he is producing has a
tremendous effect on that sound through (largely) unconscious fine
manipulation of these variables.
When all is said and done it doesn't really matter if a player thinks he
gets a better sound by putting his tongue in X or Y position--as long as
that leads to the sound he desires. But people should not make the mistake
of ascribing the changes to the wrong source.
My two cents,
Toby
----- Original Message -----
From: <monxmood@free.fr>
To: toby <kymarto@gol.com>
Sent: Saturday, April 28, 2001 6:47 AM
Subject: RE: Response to Toby
> The physicists should check out Bulgaian kaval players who use the cavity
of the mouth to create very pronounced wah-wah effects. This works mainly in
the lower octave which is the octave you would be whistling in if you took
the flute away without changing the position of the mouth. Admittedly the
coupling is closer since the kaval is virtually wedged between the teeth.
But I find the technique is transferrable to shakuhachi playing as well. You
just gotta practice it a little bit more is all.
>
>
> > ** Original Subject: RE: Response to Jamaes Schlefer Re: tongue position
> > ** Original Sender: "toby" <kymarto@gol.com>
> > ** Original Date: 27 Apr 2001 10:11:28 -0000
>
> > ** Original Message follows...
>
> >
> > FWIW the physicists say that in flute playing the position of the tongue
and
> > the shape of the mouth and throat do not affect the sound except insofar
as
> > they affect the air jet that passes the lips. This is not true of other
> > woodwind instruments (such as the oboe, clarinet and sax) where the
mouth
> > cavity becomes a secondary resonating system that is coupled to and
loads
> > the primary resonating system comprising reed, mpc and the air column in
the
> > instrument.
> >
> > But as always, how one feels about the mechanics and accoutrements of
> > playing have a major impact on the playing itself.
> >
> > Toby
> > ----- Original Message -----From: Peter Ross
<peteross@cloudhandsmusic.com>
> > To: shakuhachi discussion group <shakuhachi@weber.ucsd.edu>
> > Sent: Friday, April 27, 2001 3:21 PM
> > Subject: Response to Jamaes Schlefer Re: tongue position
> >
> >
> > > James,
> > >
> > > When I play I try to open my mouth cavity and throat to the maximum to
> > > get a rich tone color. To do this I pull my tongue down and back away
> > > from my lower teeth. Sometimes it rests just in back of my lower
teeth,
> > > but usually it's way down and back. This helps me get a very rounded
> > > shape in my mouth and the sound I like.
> > >
> > > At Yokoyama Katsuya's master class at the Boulder Shakuhachi Festival,
> > > he said that he curls his tongue and uses it like a funnel I've
never
> > > seriously tried that, but it's worth looking into since his sound is
> > > unbelievable.
> > >
> > > Connected to this subject is something I read in a book about John
> > > Coltrane last night. Here's what he said:
> > >
> > > "The sound you get on any instrument depends on the conception of
sound
> > > you hear in your mind. It also depends on our physical properties,
> > > such as the shape and structure of the inside of your mouth and
throat."
> > >
> > > I believe this explains why we all get different tone colors on flutes
> > > that aren't that different from each other. And why players like
> > > Coltrane and Sonny Rollins and Stan Getz , Lester Young, Paul Desmond
> > > etc. got vastly different tones out of their horns. They all basically
> > > played the same horn. But, they placed their tongues differently,
had
> > > differently shaped and sized mouths and throats.
> > >
> > > Anyway, that's my two cents.
> > >
> > > Peter Ross
> > >
> > > Cloudhandsmusic.com
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Hello all.
> > >
> > > The question is... Where do you place your tongue when you play?
> > >
> > > Over the past year or so I have been making a change in my playing
with
> > > respect to the placement of
> > > the tongue. This is a big challenge but one that is well worth it as
it
> > > has improved my sound. In
> > > querying a number of great shakuhachi players on this matter, both
> > > American and Japanese, I have
> > > gotten a variety of responses as to where folks put the tongue. Almost
> > > everyone agrees, however, that
> > > this is an interesting question, and an aspect of playing and teaching
> > > that is generally not covered.
> > >
> > > Until now I have put the tongue pressing up against the lower lip when
I
> > > play. This method offers
> > > several advantages but also some big disadvantages. Advantages: it
keeps
> > > the mouth and lips forward
> > > when playing and it is good for meris. It also offers a sense of
> > > security. Disadvantages: you play too
> > > flat, and the sound, while good, is never really focused.
> > >
> > > There are several options for placing the tongue. One is to simply let
> > > it hang out loosely in the mouth.
> > > Another is to press it up against the back teeth. Another is to curl
it
> > > upwards slightly. Depending on
> > > the different colors and pitches you want to make, you can move the
> > > tongue into different positions as
> > > you play. I have adapted the hang out method primarily but often press
> > > it into the lower lip for meris
> > > and dai meris, and occasionally move it around during a long note to
> > > help change the color.
> > >
> > > All thoughts on this matter are welcome.
> > >
> > > James
> > >
> > > ____________________
> > > James Nyoraku Schlefer
> > > Shakuhachi
> > > www.nyoraku.com
> > > (718) 499-7793
> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
>
>
> >** --------- End Original Message ----------- **
>
> >
>
> Paul Hirsh
> 40 place Anatole France
> 31000 Toulouse, France
> tél fax +33 5 62 27 00 49
>
>
>
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>
>
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