--- Bill O'Connor <billo44@gaea.ocn.ne.jp> wrote:
>
> Justin wrote...
> 'So far I am focusing on Yokoyama playing Dokyoku. I
> know that ancient pieces I have been taught have
> different pitches, and I have been wondering when
> the
> pitches changed. Was it Watazumi who changed them? I
> would love to know about this if anyone has any
> information.'
>
> I don't have information, my speculation for what
> its worth (my -25cents you
> might say)
> is that that these pitches have been in a constant
> state of change ever
> since the Dokyoku were first played.
I wonder. I would not necessarily expect that, though
I could imagine it. I think it may depend at least
partly on how the pitches used are related (or not) to
scales in common use. If they were directly related, I
would imagine that people would have in thrie mind a
set of pitches which sounded "right" to them, just as
some Arabic or Chinese pitches sound "wrong", or "out
of tune" to many westerners. So that might give the
interval a certain amount fixedness which may not so
quickly be overcome. Though I could imagine different
pitches developing into a sort of isolated school away
from the pitch norms. But I wouldn't expect them to
just change a lot from player to player. Not usually.
However if there were a change in the commonly heard
music (such as when western music came to Japan) that
could possibly change the pitches played perhaps?
> The music is an aural transmission and has been
> passed down without notation
> up until Kinko 1 started to travel the country
> notating the Hon Kyoku.
>
> Certainly the ability to accurately measure pitch is
> a recent tool which was
> not widely available in years past.
I think it is worth noting that I also measured my own
pitches. I had made a recording of myself a while ago
playing Tamuke on a hochiku I made. So now that I was
analysing Yokoyama, I tried analysing the recording of
me to see what I had been playing. As it turned out,
my tsu-meri in otsu was 27cents flatter than in 12ET,
and in kan it was about 24cents flatter. These are
only rough figures and only for one recording, but I
think it shows, that just from learning through
traditional way, and even with my own-made hochiku, my
pitch was very consistent with the lineage. This is of
course before I used any measuring devise. And all the
notation shows me is finger positions, not pitch.
> Watazumi by all accounts changed anything in the
> Dokyoku he had a feeling to
> change, but I don't suppose he was the only one in
> the history of the music
> who innovated.
No, I'm sure you're right.
> I'm not trying to put down this element of your
> study by the way, that is to
> say your analysis of these intervals. I hope it
> helps you and I respect
> your commitment. I look forward to reading more.
I'll try to keep you posted.
> Your point about Shakuhachi makers only tuning the
> open holes is true, but
> surely a respectable maker is also playing the meri
> notes during the tuning
> process to confirm there are no anomalies in the
> response of the flute.
Yes, but, I meant that the accuracy thing may be most
useful in the tuning of the open holes, as we want to
get them accurate in pitch.
Best wishes
Justin
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